T@b 400...worth the upgrade?

We are considering making the move to the bigger t@b.  We currently have an S max. My wife doesn't like the port holes and the weird storage around them on the interior.  However, we have not seen a 400 in person, yet.  Anyone have any insight?
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Comments

  • booboo Posts: 625Member
    The 400 is nice and has more room inside. However, i`m not willing to pay $31,000 for this size camper. After owning a 320 for a year or so, i`m not convinced they are made that much better that other brands.
    That is the price I was quoted at my Nu Camp dealer a week ago.
  • WanderinginWonderWanderinginWonder Posts: 38Member
    @boo We bought ours for $26k so that's $7k more than the 320-S. Also that price was from 2 different dealers here in NC. They were both within $100 of each other. I guess it does come down to the price you are able to get them at. 
    2018 T@B 400 Silver and Black "Luxo" / 2009 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo - Jeremy and Andrea - Southport, NC
  • Michigan_MikeMichigan_Mike Posts: 2,153Administrator
    We are considering making the move to the bigger t@b.  We currently have an S max. My wife doesn't like the port holes and the weird storage around them on the interior.  However, we have not seen a 400 in person, yet.  Anyone have any insight?
    I've seen the 400 and they are beautiful and much more spacious than the 320's.   The only issue I see is that if you are in bed and need to use the bathroom you will either need to be closest to the bathroom or you'll have to climb over your partner.  It is different than the 320 S in that the bed stays up, no slats or tear down needed and there is ample storage and a dinette area where you can eat meals, have coffee, etc.  I love the modernistic and classy recessed lighting inside the trailer, the bathroom is heated and the kitchen cooking area and closet/clothing storage areas set it head and shoulders above the smaller T@B 320 model.   I would LOVE to have one!!!!
    Mike Smith 
    Linden, Mi
    2015 T@B Max S
    Attached Image
  • rhaspyhonkerrhaspyhonker Posts: 33Member
    The question my wife raised (she's always playing devil's advocate) is price per square foot.  She likes Keystone products ...like the passport elite. There's a 23' model that has everything that the 400 has but over twice the space and runs about $24K. How do argue for a tab 400 in that case?  Vast difference in quality? I'm not sure.  Aerodynamics? Boondockability?  I gotta see these units in person before I can decide, I guess.
  • RatkityRatkity Posts: 3,077Member
    Quality, customer responsiveness and a customer-based business strategy. 
    2017 820R Retro Toy Hauler from 2015 Tabitha T@B from 2009 Reverse LG Teardrop (but a T@Bluver at heart)
  • booboo Posts: 625Member
    @boo We bought ours for $26k so that's $7k more than the 320-S. Also that price was from 2 different dealers here in NC. They were both within $100 of each other. I guess it does come down to the price you are able to get them at. 
    $26,000 is much more reasonable and probably a fair price.
    I`m not lying about the price quote. It came from Chilhowee RV in Alcoa Tn.
    When the 400 first came out, I was hearing prices floating around as high as $35,000.
  • jkjennjkjenn Posts: 4,123Member
    One thing that weighs on me is that the slightly larger units make it that much harder to find spots for. If you do mostly commercial or big state park CGs, it won't matter. If you boondock or do smaller FS CGs it could be an issue. I have fit into some tiny spots with the 320.

    Jenn Grover | 2015  T@b S Max Silver/Turquoise Trim | 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland | Nights spent in T@b: 148 | Pittsburgh PA

  • WanderinginWonderWanderinginWonder Posts: 38Member
    The small size is definitely a great perk. You can get it parked into almost any spot anywhere. Boondocking would be no issue at all. With my work schedule we haven't had a chance to go boondocking yet but we plan to soon. 
    2018 T@B 400 Silver and Black "Luxo" / 2009 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo - Jeremy and Andrea - Southport, NC
  • JiroTXJiroTX Posts: 124Member
    After two years, I finally sold my T@B last month. I wanted to look at the 400, but nobody around here had it. I have been looking at tons of travel trailers in the past few months. I felt like I wouldn't find anything that would satisfy me every time I looked at those trailers. T@B's quality is way above anything I have looked at. Every time I open the cabinets of non-T@B trailers and press down the bottom part of it, I feel like it's going to break on the first trip. They only use really thin boards.

    As other members mentioned, NuCamp's customer service is really good. I don't think you can get that type of service from anywhere else.

    I just ordered me an Winnebago Micro Minnie 1706FB. It is 4ft longer and 1ft wider than T@B Outback I had, but it feels like it's three times larger inside. The cabinets are built way better than other manufactures. I know I am going to miss my T@B (it was my first travel trailer), but I think I made a right choice. I will need to wait for 2-3 months for it to be delivered.


  • jkjennjkjenn Posts: 4,123Member
    JiroTX said:
    After two years, I finally sold my T@B last month. I wanted to look at the 400, but nobody around here had it. I have been looking at tons of travel trailers in the past few months. I felt like I wouldn't find anything that would satisfy me every time I looked at those trailers. T@B's quality is way above anything I have looked at. Every time I open the cabinets of non-T@B trailers and press down the bottom part of it, I feel like it's going to break on the first trip. They only use really thin boards.

    As other members mentioned, NuCamp's customer service is really good. I don't think you can get that type of service from anywhere else.

    I just ordered me an Winnebago Micro Minnie 1706FB. It is 4ft longer and 1ft wider than T@B Outback I had, but it feels like it's three times larger inside. The cabinets are built way better than other manufactures. I know I am going to miss my T@B (it was my first travel trailer), but I think I made a right choice. I will need to wait for 2-3 months for it to be delivered.


     Best of luck with your Whinnie. Be sure to stop back and tell us what you like and don't like about it.

    Jenn Grover | 2015  T@b S Max Silver/Turquoise Trim | 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland | Nights spent in T@b: 148 | Pittsburgh PA

  • JiroTXJiroTX Posts: 124Member
    jkjenn said:
     Best of luck with your Whinnie. Be sure to stop back and tell us what you like and don't like about it.
    Thanks Jenn, I will post my thoughts (and pics) after my first trip with Micro Minnie.

    Jiro
  • rhaspyhonkerrhaspyhonker Posts: 33Member
    edited August 2017
    I am very aware of the excellent level of customer service at pleasant valley trailers, aka little guy, aka, nucamp.  Our t@b 320 Max S was frought with problems including dealer stupidity (running the AC full blast with the tongue cranked up as high as it could go...water everywhere inside the camper just as we signed the papers to buy it). Ed Kaufman was amazing and we ended up with a brand new 320 about 6 months later just because they wanted us happy!  It helps that we only live about an hour from the factory in Sugar creek, Ohio! Thanks for all of your input on this issue.  This will be a major factor when making our decision.
  • atlasbatlasb Posts: 222Member
    our 400 is the 3rd pleasant valley/ NU Camp product.  We have always enjoyed the quality, size and everything about them.  Where ever we go, some one remarks about how neat they are. then usually a story about a big trailer at home that never goes any where because it is too much to use.  When our first 400 got to the dealer we visited to pick it up only to find it had some issues.  The dealer and Nu Camp talked and it was decided they would take it back to fix the problems.  We got a call later that said they were building us a new one.  Not something we had ever considered as usually most manufactures feel once it is out of their hands and in yours it is yours. Nu Camp delivered our new 400 to yesterday a distance of 1000 miles one way.  While the driver was backing it into our shop for us, a neighbor was stopped waiting for the road to clear and he told my wife,  I have been looking on line and I want one of those.  We had not even got it in the shop yet and already some one wanted to check it out.  For us, we know it is a decision that everyone has to make according to their needs.  We have sat in it and just marveled at how well everything fits and all the features.  Can't wait to get it all set up and head out.  Knowing what NU Camp did for us and many other owners makes the choice so much easier and then add the quality of the product.  We loved our 320 but for us this 400 is the diamond on the top of the ring!
    2018 T@B 400, 2016 Nissan Frontier Crew cab
  • atlasbatlasb Posts: 222Member
    2018 T@B 400, 2016 Nissan Frontier Crew cab
  • BillReddingBillRedding Posts: 26Member
    edited August 2017
    "My wife doesn't like the port holes and the weird storage around them on the interior." --rhaspyhonker

    I don't mind the portholes, but agree with your wife about those those storage cubbies" around them. I see them as wasted space you have to fish items out of as you can't even see back there -- poor use of space, IMO. Must be a "euro" design thing that's popular over in the EU but doesn't make practical sense here in the US market...needs rethinking/redesigning.

    Not sure about the similar "storage cubbies" on the bathroom wall, either, so would like to see them rethought, too.

    Finally, do not like the stereo's location way up high on the wall in a very awkward spot you have one knee on the bed to access -- or contort your body around the corner to access. THAT makes no sense, either.

    I DO like the 400's fold-down bathroom sink (looks much better and more practical/functional than the folding sink in the Winnebago Paseo 48P Class B I'm also looking at).

    OTHERWISE, the T@B 400 looks pretty good. :-)

    Hope it has room for 3 large solar panesl on the roof and 2 larger (lithium) house batteries!

    -- BR

  • sherm2954sherm2954 Posts: 38Member
    We haven't bought anything yet, but just looking at T@b vs RPod, etc, there is a huge difference in quality. I won't buy anything that has fake woodwork "decals"on particle board. The fit and finish of the 320 and 400 is head and shoulders above the rest. BMW vs Yugo. 
  • Michigan_MikeMichigan_Mike Posts: 2,153Administrator
    "My wife doesn't like the port holes and the weird storage around them on the interior." --rhaspyhonker

    I don't mind the portholes, but agree with your wife about those those storage cubbies" around them. I see them as wasted space you have to fish items out of as you can't even see back there -- poor use of space, IMO. Must be a "euro" design thing that's popular over in the EU but doesn't make practical sense here in the US market...needs rethinking/redesigning.

    Not sure about the similar "storage cubbies" on the bathroom wall, either, so would like to see them rethought, too.

    Finally, do not like the stereo's location way up high on the wall in a very awkward spot you have one knee on the bed to access -- or contort your body around the corner to access. THAT makes no sense, either.

    I DO like the 400's fold-down bathroom sink (looks much better and more practical/functional than the folding sink in the Winnebago Paseo 48P Class B I'm also looking at).

    OTHERWISE, the T@B 400 looks pretty good. :-)

    Hope it has room for 3 large solar panesl on the roof and 2 larger (lithium) house batteries!

    -- BR

    I had to chuckle when I read your comments above as your observations are interesting and shows that we all differ in expectations, etc....  No doubt nothing in the world is ever perfect, nor will one trailer fit the needs of every individual/potential buyer who peers into them or uses them as we are all different individuals in what we consider to be our wants, needs and desires.  I remember seeing the first prototype 400 down in Elkhart last fall and hearing someone complaining about the fold down sink and "why would anyone want a fold down sink?"  I also found it interesting that there were so many trailer manufacturers located throughout ELkhart and that they all cater to different crowds.  

    The 400 was in fact designed with a "Euro" feel if you will by nüCamp and also with their own input and collaboration therein.   One thing I'll also note is that they are constantly weighing and adding to their design via user input (and suggestions, ideass, etc.) and you can expect subtle changes and add-ons in future units as they seek to improve upon their trailers and incorporate the latest technologies available, while also weighing costs for the end user.  

    In speaking to factory owner/founder Joe Mullet, they do want to be competitive, produce a unit that is always high quality, try to keep the weight of their units down via incorporating composite type materials, insulate them with the latest/greatest materials available and with the idea of always looking to impove upon and provide a quality product, over just assembling/building/mass producing trailers.   Obviously they would ideally love to produce about 17-18 of the 400's a week (per Joe Mullet) as opposed to their current rate of 8 per week, but Joe said that they will not sacrifice quality over quantity and he understands that it will take them time to achieve the higher goal of producing more units and keeping their trailer quality at the highest level possible.  

    And what a testament to personal commitment to customer satisfaction via atlasb's experience above with the company building them a brand new replacement trailer!   Who else in the RV or trailer industry does anything remotely similar?   
    Mike Smith 
    Linden, Mi
    2015 T@B Max S
    Attached Image
  • AlanAlan Posts: 108Member
    We are in our third night, on the way to Canada and then Glacier,
    . The 400 is beyond awesome!  And, Southwoods rv is the best w Dr!
  • Justin_in_SeattleJustin_in_Seattle Posts: 43Member
    edited August 2017
    JiroTX said:
    I just ordered me an Winnebago Micro Minnie 1706FB. It is 4ft longer and 1ft wider than T@B Outback I had, but it feels like it's three times larger inside. The cabinets are built way better than other manufactures. I know I am going to miss my T@B (it was my first travel trailer), but I think I made a right choice. I will need to wait for 2-3 months for it to be delivered.


    JiroTX, we also took a look at the Winnebago Micro Minnie. However the GVWR of 5,500 lb scared us off, since my TV is only rated up to 3,500 lb, and we didn't want to accidentally overload the trailer.

    Overall the Micro Minnie like a solid choice, if your TV can handle it. We went with the T@B 400 in the end. Arrives next month.
    2018 nuCamp T@B 400  +  2016 BMW X1 tow vehicle
  • JiroTXJiroTX Posts: 124Member
    JiroTX, we also took a look at the Winnebago Micro Minnie. However the GVWR of 5,500 lb scared us off, since my TV is only rated up to 3,500 lb, and we didn't want to accidentally overload the trailer.

    Overall the Micro Minnie like a solid choice, if your TV can handle it. We went with the T@B 400 in the end. Arrives next month.
    Justin,

    I don't want to be the weight police here, but you will need to be very careful on the weight. The 400 has Tongue Weight 325-370lb. I am not sure if that's the dry weight or loaded, but you are most likely over your vehicle's GVWR. You might want to go to the CAT scale with all the passengers/cargo/full tank of gas and see how much your vehicle weighs and subtract that from GVWR of your TV (the tongue weight cannot go above this number). It will probably tow with no problem still, but you need to remember that your insurance can always say "no" if you are towing illegally over the capacity.

    If the listed tongue weight is the "dry weight," it can be lower when loaded since you will have the huge/heavy battery in the back under your bed.

    Jiro
  • Justin_in_SeattleJustin_in_Seattle Posts: 43Member
    edited August 2017
    JiroTX said:
    You might want to go to the CAT scale with all the passengers/cargo/full tank of gas and see how much your vehicle weighs and subtract that from GVWR of your TV (the tongue weight cannot go above this number). 

    Thanks for your advice, Jiro. We're weekend warriors (have to get the kiddo back to elementary school each Monday morning :) ) so we'll always be towing the 400 with partially-full tanks, partially-full fridge, etc. We're also investing in a weight distribution hitch and a tongue scale. Our hitch max tongue weight is 525 lb so we should be within tongue limits.

    The dry weight of the 400 is 2700, so after subtracting weights for me, my wife, and son, we have ~500 lb left for water, food, and equipment. That's not a lot of margin so we'll definitely take your advice and stop at a weigh station to make sure we're not over the limit.
    2018 nuCamp T@B 400  +  2016 BMW X1 tow vehicle
  • jason330ijason330i Posts: 59Member
    If the average purchase price of a T@b 400 is $26k, I would probably go with a Lance 1575 for about the same price. :)

    2017 T@b 320 S

    2017 Kia Sorento SXL AWD

  • JiroTXJiroTX Posts: 124Member
    Justin,

    getting a tongue scale probably is a good idea if you are close to the limit. I don't think your car is rated for 525lb tongue weight if it is rated for 3,500lb towing. It is more likely 350lb.

    WDH probably is not needed for the 400. It will add extra 50-80lb to your hitch or gross weight. You will need to check the GVWR of your TV and subtract the real weight that you get from CAT scale. That or what the manual says (whichever smaller) is your hitch weight limit.
    Car manufactures usually set the hitch weight limit for driver only with no passengers/cargo. I think your hitch weight limit with your wife and your son will be close to 200lb with nothing in the cargo area depending on which vehicle you have. I assume you have either a minivan or an SUV since your TV's towing capacity is 3,500lb. Minivans usually have higher GVWR.

    Like I said, your vehicle will probably tow the 400 with no issues, and a lot of people here will tell you that's fine. Just remember if you are over the capacity, your insurance can say "no" to your claim.

    Jiro
  • roguebooksroguebooks Posts: 31Member
    The 400 is looking more and more as the one for us. Seems we'll have to order one as we do need the solar option and I have never seen a 400 for sale with it already included. Anybody with experience with solar on the 400? And what about comparisons with a 320 Outback model as I see there is no off-road option with the 400?
    Mike
    Home in Florida/Cabin in Michigan
    Tow Vehicle: Tacoma TRD Sport 4x4
    Oliver Legacy Elite 18.5
  • VernaVerna Posts: 4,215Administrator
    Do a search for 400 at the top right of the page and there is a lot of information already out there. 
    Verna, Indianapolis, Indiana; 2014 T@B S M@X, white/red, INDIANA  H@@SIER; towed by 2015 Toyota Tacoma V6 TRD 4x4; T@B Administrator
  • skwheeskwhee Posts: 209Member
    @roguebooks We ordered our without the solar option. We prefer a suitcase style for better tracking of the sun throughout the day and the option of placing the camper in a shady spot.
    Although the 400 does not have an official off-road option, it does come with 15 inch tires, and a pitched axle as standard like the 320 Outback does. We really love ❤️ ours. Hope this helps. 
    Steve and Karen Cullowhee, North Carolina 2008 Ford F150 --2018 T@B 400
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